What selection tests at AFCEPF?
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Samia Gamal
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Caillou -
Hello,
I am currently in a career transition and I would like to know if anyone has ever tried the selection tests for entry to AFCEPF, for a training course that does not require prior knowledge in IT... I have to take a 40-minute test next week and I am not sure which type of tests I should focus on primarily: graphic series, dominoes, sequences? Do you have a particular website or book you would recommend?
Thank you in advance
Samia
I am currently in a career transition and I would like to know if anyone has ever tried the selection tests for entry to AFCEPF, for a training course that does not require prior knowledge in IT... I have to take a 40-minute test next week and I am not sure which type of tests I should focus on primarily: graphic series, dominoes, sequences? Do you have a particular website or book you would recommend?
Thank you in advance
Samia
11 réponses
Good evening everyone,
I would like to add to what has been said above, particularly the response from honeymoon51.
In the selection process, I made it to the interview stage but unfortunately was not selected.
So, on Tuesday, November 15, 2016, I arrived at the (temporary) offices of AFCEPF, in the PFIZER building, 23-25 avenue du Docteur Lannelongue, 75014 Paris.
We started approximately at 10:15 with the information meeting. It was Mr. RAKOTOMALALA Patrick, the school director, who led the information session. After a round of introductions from the attendees (including myself), the director presented AFCEPF, its history, philosophy, the professions, and the expectations the school has towards a future auditor (calling you a student is a bit inappropriate since you are supposed to be coming for a career change, meaning you are already in the job market). For this presentation, I suggest that you future candidates take as many notes as possible. I will come back to this later.
Following the school presentation, Mr. RAKOTOMALALA Patrick explained the trainings, the functions of the jobs targeted upon completion of the trainings (two trainings were presented here: Software Architect Developer and Front End Developer, for which I had applied), the structures of the IT professions, salaries, and the product life cycle. Future candidates, MAKE SURE TO TAKE NOTES ON EVERYTHING THAT IS MENTIONED, especially regarding the stages of the product life cycle that pertain to the targeted professions.
After the presentations of the school and the training, the tests begin:
- the first, as mentioned earlier by honeymoon51, is a series of pictograms. You have three pictograms presented sequentially, each showing sticks or dots on squares or triangles rotating clockwise or counterclockwise, and it is up to you to guess the next two pictograms by placing the sticks/dots according to the evolution of the first three pictograms. This test lasts only fifteen minutes, and time passes very quickly. Train your logic and responsiveness for this one;
- the second, again mentioned earlier by honeymoon51, is a series of reasoning sequences. There are series of words where you need to find the odd one out, numbers corresponding to letters for which you need to guess the sequence, reconstructing words from jumbled letters, ... Tests that can be found online. This test lasts twenty minutes, and again, time flies.
For someone like me, who is naturally logical and responsive to this kind of test, I only reviewed domino sequences, of which I didn't understand the principles. Otherwise, I STRONGLY ADVISE YOU TO TRAIN YOUR REACTIVITY AND LOGIC. These are the only points that can make the difference for you. They found me a bit slow, but I managed (filling out about twenty sequences for the first test and a bit less for the second).
The information meeting ends with these tests and lasted approximately two hours. I believe that once you are invited to the information meeting, the tests are only eliminatory if you made mistakes or took too long. The tests are there just to verify that you possess reasoning skills that are sufficient for the training.
To go further, for those who will have the chance to have an interview, I would like to share my testimony. I arrive at the premises on Friday, November 25, fifteen minutes before the start of the interview (always arrive early, it shows that you anticipate, but not too early, to avoid keeping you waiting too long and to spare the recruiter from making you wait too much), well-presented in a suit and white shirt (always make a good impression, show that you are a professional above all). I was then invited into an office to sit face-to-face with the HR manager and the director. So the interview started, and they asked me questions, dissecting me:
- what does AFCEPF mean to me and what are its cherished values. They expect you to answer determination, of course, but especially TEAM SPIRIT, which I was unable to answer because I hadn't taken enough notes during the information meeting;
- the director looked at my interests and checked that they were not exaggerated on my CV (Verification of my CV), here I think I answered well! Be honest, and everything will go well;
- what did I take away from the information meeting and how do I see the developer profession. Again, due to lack of note-taking and preparation, I did not provide the expected response. The director, through his non-verbal cues, made that clear. So don't forget to note every little detail during the meeting and learn them;
- why did I choose this 21-month apprenticeship (3 months of training + 18 months of paid apprenticeship at minimum wage)? According to him, given my age (+30 years), it seemed like a bad choice based on the duration and remuneration. So take the time to understand what you are getting into and how to answer this question;
- what impression would I like to leave at the end of the interview. Here, I was completely lost. Aside from mindlessly repeating my qualities mentioned on my CV, I couldn't answer. And I don't think I responded well;
- the last tricky question: "Do you have any questions?". I answered no but I should have said yes: take an interest in AFCEPF, come up with questions. Show that you really want to be part of this adventure by trying to learn more about the school.
I did not prepare enough for the interview and I regret it today because AFCEPF seems to have a good reputation with companies. In short, be prepared, do not make my mistakes. If you have any other questions, I will gladly answer them!
See you soon.
I would like to add to what has been said above, particularly the response from honeymoon51.
In the selection process, I made it to the interview stage but unfortunately was not selected.
So, on Tuesday, November 15, 2016, I arrived at the (temporary) offices of AFCEPF, in the PFIZER building, 23-25 avenue du Docteur Lannelongue, 75014 Paris.
We started approximately at 10:15 with the information meeting. It was Mr. RAKOTOMALALA Patrick, the school director, who led the information session. After a round of introductions from the attendees (including myself), the director presented AFCEPF, its history, philosophy, the professions, and the expectations the school has towards a future auditor (calling you a student is a bit inappropriate since you are supposed to be coming for a career change, meaning you are already in the job market). For this presentation, I suggest that you future candidates take as many notes as possible. I will come back to this later.
Following the school presentation, Mr. RAKOTOMALALA Patrick explained the trainings, the functions of the jobs targeted upon completion of the trainings (two trainings were presented here: Software Architect Developer and Front End Developer, for which I had applied), the structures of the IT professions, salaries, and the product life cycle. Future candidates, MAKE SURE TO TAKE NOTES ON EVERYTHING THAT IS MENTIONED, especially regarding the stages of the product life cycle that pertain to the targeted professions.
After the presentations of the school and the training, the tests begin:
- the first, as mentioned earlier by honeymoon51, is a series of pictograms. You have three pictograms presented sequentially, each showing sticks or dots on squares or triangles rotating clockwise or counterclockwise, and it is up to you to guess the next two pictograms by placing the sticks/dots according to the evolution of the first three pictograms. This test lasts only fifteen minutes, and time passes very quickly. Train your logic and responsiveness for this one;
- the second, again mentioned earlier by honeymoon51, is a series of reasoning sequences. There are series of words where you need to find the odd one out, numbers corresponding to letters for which you need to guess the sequence, reconstructing words from jumbled letters, ... Tests that can be found online. This test lasts twenty minutes, and again, time flies.
For someone like me, who is naturally logical and responsive to this kind of test, I only reviewed domino sequences, of which I didn't understand the principles. Otherwise, I STRONGLY ADVISE YOU TO TRAIN YOUR REACTIVITY AND LOGIC. These are the only points that can make the difference for you. They found me a bit slow, but I managed (filling out about twenty sequences for the first test and a bit less for the second).
The information meeting ends with these tests and lasted approximately two hours. I believe that once you are invited to the information meeting, the tests are only eliminatory if you made mistakes or took too long. The tests are there just to verify that you possess reasoning skills that are sufficient for the training.
To go further, for those who will have the chance to have an interview, I would like to share my testimony. I arrive at the premises on Friday, November 25, fifteen minutes before the start of the interview (always arrive early, it shows that you anticipate, but not too early, to avoid keeping you waiting too long and to spare the recruiter from making you wait too much), well-presented in a suit and white shirt (always make a good impression, show that you are a professional above all). I was then invited into an office to sit face-to-face with the HR manager and the director. So the interview started, and they asked me questions, dissecting me:
- what does AFCEPF mean to me and what are its cherished values. They expect you to answer determination, of course, but especially TEAM SPIRIT, which I was unable to answer because I hadn't taken enough notes during the information meeting;
- the director looked at my interests and checked that they were not exaggerated on my CV (Verification of my CV), here I think I answered well! Be honest, and everything will go well;
- what did I take away from the information meeting and how do I see the developer profession. Again, due to lack of note-taking and preparation, I did not provide the expected response. The director, through his non-verbal cues, made that clear. So don't forget to note every little detail during the meeting and learn them;
- why did I choose this 21-month apprenticeship (3 months of training + 18 months of paid apprenticeship at minimum wage)? According to him, given my age (+30 years), it seemed like a bad choice based on the duration and remuneration. So take the time to understand what you are getting into and how to answer this question;
- what impression would I like to leave at the end of the interview. Here, I was completely lost. Aside from mindlessly repeating my qualities mentioned on my CV, I couldn't answer. And I don't think I responded well;
- the last tricky question: "Do you have any questions?". I answered no but I should have said yes: take an interest in AFCEPF, come up with questions. Show that you really want to be part of this adventure by trying to learn more about the school.
I did not prepare enough for the interview and I regret it today because AFCEPF seems to have a good reputation with companies. In short, be prepared, do not make my mistakes. If you have any other questions, I will gladly answer them!
See you soon.
TRUE! At least as far as I'm concerned. You have the right to a different opinion. You are not allowed to accuse me of saying false things.
I could just as easily say the same about your statements:
"these tests, which all look alike" is a falsehood!
At AFPA alone, the tests vary depending on the field of work considered (wood, agriculture, IT, management, mechanics, personal services, hospitality-restoration...) and according to the level of the diploma to be obtained (level V CAP/BEP, level IV BT/BP, level III BTS/DUT).
"You can find a bunch of free "IQ tests" on the web" that's true ...
But Samia Gamal asked for information about selection tests for admission to Grande École; not about tests measuring Intelligence Quotient. When you talk to guidance counselors and occupational psychologists, who use tests to select candidates, they will smile politely (or laugh heartily) when you mention these free tests which, indeed, are rampant in women's magazines and on the web, like energy pills and drinks, with the same lack of effectiveness ...
I am confident: Samia will have the wisdom to heed my advice rather than yours.
--
Retirement is great! Especially in the Antilles ... :-)
☻ Raymond ♂
I could just as easily say the same about your statements:
"these tests, which all look alike" is a falsehood!
At AFPA alone, the tests vary depending on the field of work considered (wood, agriculture, IT, management, mechanics, personal services, hospitality-restoration...) and according to the level of the diploma to be obtained (level V CAP/BEP, level IV BT/BP, level III BTS/DUT).
"You can find a bunch of free "IQ tests" on the web" that's true ...
But Samia Gamal asked for information about selection tests for admission to Grande École; not about tests measuring Intelligence Quotient. When you talk to guidance counselors and occupational psychologists, who use tests to select candidates, they will smile politely (or laugh heartily) when you mention these free tests which, indeed, are rampant in women's magazines and on the web, like energy pills and drinks, with the same lack of effectiveness ...
I am confident: Samia will have the wisdom to heed my advice rather than yours.
--
Retirement is great! Especially in the Antilles ... :-)
☻ Raymond ♂
Nothing is stopping you from training.. your brain won’t short-circuit
When you say "We are either capable of succeeding in these tests or we are not, that's all." it's as if you were saying "either we are made for school, or we are not, we are born like this" and more bluntly "either we are smart, or we are dumb"
Come on Raymond Pentier, take a step back, dilute your wine, abandon the Middle Ages and open yourself up to the new methods of the 21st century!
When you say "We are either capable of succeeding in these tests or we are not, that's all." it's as if you were saying "either we are made for school, or we are not, we are born like this" and more bluntly "either we are smart, or we are dumb"
Come on Raymond Pentier, take a step back, dilute your wine, abandon the Middle Ages and open yourself up to the new methods of the 21st century!
Hello,
I would like to say that I share Sam's opinion that training in any type of exercise leads to better success.
I wonder on what basis Raymond PENTIER says that training is unnecessary, when all effective pedagogies in the world emphasize training. As for the "gifted" individuals who don’t need training, I find it a bit surprising that they consider their case to be a generality. Regarding the cost, you can find books for €5, not to mention several free IQ test websites that are quite suitable for the AFCEPF test.
Personally, I have known university colleagues who made such claims, but it was a strategy to stifle competition... Even graduates from prestigious schools do exercises before exams... we must not let common sense be undermined, TRAIN YOURSELF!
As for the tests I took at AFCEPF on 12/23/2013, they are organized into 2 series:
- 30 series of pictograms where the first three elements are given, and you must guess the next 2.
- 40 logic questions of different types: numerical sequences, odd words, relationships between numbers and words, similarity of relationship between 2 words (e.g. the wheel is to the car what the wing is to the plane)...
Good luck to all.
Rabah LEKHEBASSENE
I would like to say that I share Sam's opinion that training in any type of exercise leads to better success.
I wonder on what basis Raymond PENTIER says that training is unnecessary, when all effective pedagogies in the world emphasize training. As for the "gifted" individuals who don’t need training, I find it a bit surprising that they consider their case to be a generality. Regarding the cost, you can find books for €5, not to mention several free IQ test websites that are quite suitable for the AFCEPF test.
Personally, I have known university colleagues who made such claims, but it was a strategy to stifle competition... Even graduates from prestigious schools do exercises before exams... we must not let common sense be undermined, TRAIN YOURSELF!
As for the tests I took at AFCEPF on 12/23/2013, they are organized into 2 series:
- 30 series of pictograms where the first three elements are given, and you must guess the next 2.
- 40 logic questions of different types: numerical sequences, odd words, relationships between numbers and words, similarity of relationship between 2 words (e.g. the wheel is to the car what the wing is to the plane)...
Good luck to all.
Rabah LEKHEBASSENE
Raymond PENTIER draws on 40 years of leadership in Vocational Training Centers and especially in Adult Vocational Training, where candidate selection is conducted exclusively through psychotechnical tests. So I don’t have much to learn on the subject...
You have your opinion on the matter; I have mine.
Our experiences are different, our views as well. I haven't been involved in academic circles, let alone at the École Centrale!
Let Samia decide between our two arguments.
But given your stance, you should have followed up on her main question, “Do you have a website or a book you would particularly recommend?”
You have your opinion on the matter; I have mine.
Our experiences are different, our views as well. I haven't been involved in academic circles, let alone at the École Centrale!
Let Samia decide between our two arguments.
But given your stance, you should have followed up on her main question, “Do you have a website or a book you would particularly recommend?”
Hello everyone,
Having taken the test this week without success :-( I can give you tips that may help you succeed.
Firstly, there are two series. The first one lasts about 10 to 15 minutes and is BASED SOLELY on pictograms. Basically, squares or triangles with lines, and you have to guess the sequence (for example, whether to follow the clockwise or counterclockwise direction, etc.). And it's really based on SPEED!!! Practice as much as you can with logical reasoning test books because you need to validate 15 answers out of 30, meaning 30 seconds per question. That tells you that no one finished, but the goal is to succeed in at least half.
The second series is pure and hard reasoning. There are about 40 questions and you need to validate at least 20 out of the 40. You will have around 20 minutes to do this, if I remember correctly (time flies super fast).
The reasoning series is not easy, but I found it easier than the first series... it includes number sequences, letter sequences, numbers, words. All of this exists in training series online and for preparation for public service entrance exams, so study as much as possible.
In my opinion, a good month of work with about two solid hours of training per day is sufficient. Cramming at the last minute doesn’t work. The brain needs to get used to the questions and respond as quickly as possible.
The tests are quite selective, but if you train, you can do it.
Good luck to everyone!!
Having taken the test this week without success :-( I can give you tips that may help you succeed.
Firstly, there are two series. The first one lasts about 10 to 15 minutes and is BASED SOLELY on pictograms. Basically, squares or triangles with lines, and you have to guess the sequence (for example, whether to follow the clockwise or counterclockwise direction, etc.). And it's really based on SPEED!!! Practice as much as you can with logical reasoning test books because you need to validate 15 answers out of 30, meaning 30 seconds per question. That tells you that no one finished, but the goal is to succeed in at least half.
The second series is pure and hard reasoning. There are about 40 questions and you need to validate at least 20 out of the 40. You will have around 20 minutes to do this, if I remember correctly (time flies super fast).
The reasoning series is not easy, but I found it easier than the first series... it includes number sequences, letter sequences, numbers, words. All of this exists in training series online and for preparation for public service entrance exams, so study as much as possible.
In my opinion, a good month of work with about two solid hours of training per day is sufficient. Cramming at the last minute doesn’t work. The brain needs to get used to the questions and respond as quickly as possible.
The tests are quite selective, but if you train, you can do it.
Good luck to everyone!!
Concentrating is useless; consulting books or websites is useless too:
We either have the ability to pass these tests or we don't, that's it.
And the so-called test preparations are generally expensive scams that are absolutely ineffective.
See this discussion https://forums.commentcamarche.net/forum/affich-25910089-test-logique-afpa-developpeur-logiciel
--
Retirement is great! Especially in the Caribbean... :-)
☻ Raymond ♂
We either have the ability to pass these tests or we don't, that's it.
And the so-called test preparations are generally expensive scams that are absolutely ineffective.
See this discussion https://forums.commentcamarche.net/forum/affich-25910089-test-logique-afpa-developpeur-logiciel
--
Retirement is great! Especially in the Caribbean... :-)
☻ Raymond ♂
FALSE! Training helps to understand the mechanics of these tests, which are all similar, and therefore makes it easier to find the answers by practicing. Although indeed, some people will find it easier to grasp the reasoning.
There are plenty of free "IQ tests" available online. There's no need to spend money to study for them.
There are plenty of free "IQ tests" available online. There's no need to spend money to study for them.
Samia Gamal, I will also take the test at the beginning of March. Can you tell me what the test is about because I'm really in deep trouble? From what I understand from a forum, there are two types of tests; one on reasoning and the other part on algorithmic logic.
I'm waiting for your response, thank you.
I'm waiting for your response, thank you.
Training will allow you to achieve two things:
- understand as many "typical" logic mechanisms as possible
- go faster!
This is important because these tests are time-limited.
The two test batteries.
To give you an idea, the average score is 30-35 correct answers on these tests.
However, the training has experienced high demand because it is a partner of POE pole emploi. So, a competition of 2000 candidates is not easy.
Train hard, and good luck!
- understand as many "typical" logic mechanisms as possible
- go faster!
This is important because these tests are time-limited.
The two test batteries.
To give you an idea, the average score is 30-35 correct answers on these tests.
However, the training has experienced high demand because it is a partner of POE pole emploi. So, a competition of 2000 candidates is not easy.
Train hard, and good luck!
Hello everyone
Bati, are there really 2000 candidates in each of their sessions? What sources are you basing this claim on?
I will be taking the tests soon, and if I don't get chosen that's okay, I will consider being self-taught and earning diplomas from OpenClassroom. But I hope it doesn't come to that; the AFCEPF training is far superior to what I've seen so far.
Another question:
On the day of the tests, which will last 40 minutes, there will be an information meeting for 1 hour. Everything will start at 5 PM. This suggests that we will finish around 7 PM. So what about the interviews with the jury and recruiters? Are we summoned on an earlier date? What questions should we expect in the interview? Do we need to provide references beforehand?
Thank you in advance if you answer my questions.
Bati, are there really 2000 candidates in each of their sessions? What sources are you basing this claim on?
I will be taking the tests soon, and if I don't get chosen that's okay, I will consider being self-taught and earning diplomas from OpenClassroom. But I hope it doesn't come to that; the AFCEPF training is far superior to what I've seen so far.
Another question:
On the day of the tests, which will last 40 minutes, there will be an information meeting for 1 hour. Everything will start at 5 PM. This suggests that we will finish around 7 PM. So what about the interviews with the jury and recruiters? Are we summoned on an earlier date? What questions should we expect in the interview? Do we need to provide references beforehand?
Thank you in advance if you answer my questions.
I am pleased to announce that I have successfully passed the selection. I would like to discuss it with you without giving too much information that could jeopardize the entire AFCEPF process. I can also tell you that the director and a trainer will make up the jury. As for the questions, they will be tailored on a case-by-case basis depending on each application and will mainly aim to assess your psychology and personality. Good luck to you.
Can someone give me a brief overview of what was said during the information session?
Thank you :)