BETCLIC = Misuse of the law
leo119
Posted messages
3
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Member
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Kouassid7 -
Kouassid7 -
Hello,
yesterday I created an account with BETCLIC and deposited 60 euros, since then my account has been locked after sending my identity card and bank details, in fact I made a mistake when filling out the registration form.
I didn’t think that this form had to match SCRUPULOUSLY with the identity card (no typos, no diminutive instead of the first name ...), nothing indicates that if the data is EXACTLY identical to your identity card they will lock your account, seize your money (it’s almost like they’ll show up at your place and take everything else !!).
In this age of technology, they could specify this at the top of the form and implement a double validation like for passwords, given the importance of this data!
Naively, I thought it was a form like those on 99% of websites, and I repeat nothing indicates otherwise!!!... Oh yes... the checkbox for accepting the terms and conditions!! Because yes, it’s written in the general conditions (4.3), but you still have to go through the 30 pages, which no one ever does.
Again naively, I contacted them thinking I would correct the mistake on my registration and ask them for the procedure to follow (documents to send etc...), like in a normal world, and well NO APPEAL, "the account is locked for 3 years" (why???) and "at the end of this period the money will be returned to BETCLIC".
This morning in response to my protest email from yesterday, they replied that they are only applying their general conditions and the law, which requires them to "verify that it is an adult and a natural person by requiring the entry of a code to prevent registrations and access by computer bots" (there I didn’t grasp the connection, the law conveniently provides cover ...).
But the law states that they must verify this not "that they must seize the account and appropriate it if there has been a registration error", and especially not that the person can no longer defend themselves and demonstrate their good faith! the error becomes inalienable!!!!!!! And now we enter into interpretation, it becomes the game of seven errors for Betclic because they always win.
Epilogue: during my registration, before sending my papers, I placed my 60 euros on Denmark (Euro 2012), a risk-free bet with their offer of up to 100 euros refunded, and I received an (automatic) email this morning from Betclic informing me that I won 315 euros ....
Do you think there is a possible appeal??
yesterday I created an account with BETCLIC and deposited 60 euros, since then my account has been locked after sending my identity card and bank details, in fact I made a mistake when filling out the registration form.
I didn’t think that this form had to match SCRUPULOUSLY with the identity card (no typos, no diminutive instead of the first name ...), nothing indicates that if the data is EXACTLY identical to your identity card they will lock your account, seize your money (it’s almost like they’ll show up at your place and take everything else !!).
In this age of technology, they could specify this at the top of the form and implement a double validation like for passwords, given the importance of this data!
Naively, I thought it was a form like those on 99% of websites, and I repeat nothing indicates otherwise!!!... Oh yes... the checkbox for accepting the terms and conditions!! Because yes, it’s written in the general conditions (4.3), but you still have to go through the 30 pages, which no one ever does.
Again naively, I contacted them thinking I would correct the mistake on my registration and ask them for the procedure to follow (documents to send etc...), like in a normal world, and well NO APPEAL, "the account is locked for 3 years" (why???) and "at the end of this period the money will be returned to BETCLIC".
This morning in response to my protest email from yesterday, they replied that they are only applying their general conditions and the law, which requires them to "verify that it is an adult and a natural person by requiring the entry of a code to prevent registrations and access by computer bots" (there I didn’t grasp the connection, the law conveniently provides cover ...).
But the law states that they must verify this not "that they must seize the account and appropriate it if there has been a registration error", and especially not that the person can no longer defend themselves and demonstrate their good faith! the error becomes inalienable!!!!!!! And now we enter into interpretation, it becomes the game of seven errors for Betclic because they always win.
Epilogue: during my registration, before sending my papers, I placed my 60 euros on Denmark (Euro 2012), a risk-free bet with their offer of up to 100 euros refunded, and I received an (automatic) email this morning from Betclic informing me that I won 315 euros ....
Do you think there is a possible appeal??
14 answers
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If it's written in the charter, too bad, you are supposed to read the entire charter (I say "supposed" ^^)
You still have the option of going to court,
bye -
Same for me
I created a Facebook page
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Betclic-Mal-honn%C3%Aate/473300526028278
Join me
We need to make ourselves heard and get our money back -
Hello everyone, it is now possible to change this personal information, being a victim of a "data entry error on my place of birth."
http://www.arjel.fr/Information-aux-joueurs-mieux.html
If these gentlemen do not return your money, I advise you to send a registered letter with acknowledgment of receipt as well as to involve a local judge. I am currently dealing with their cases.
https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F1785
According to decree n°2015-620 of June 5, 2015, it is possible to modify this information and therefore recover these winnings. Who do we thank? Thank you Stéphane.
Best regards, have a nice day. -
This kind of method really gets on my nerves; they block everything supposedly for security, but if the registered person is a fraudster, the blocked money actually belongs to a victim, so why keep it?
Mmm.
I'm changing my post; I'm going to get vulgar.
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Please click on "Mark as resolved" if your issue is resolved! -
I had the same issue a year ago with bwin. I deposited 20 euros, and they doubled my deposit, so I had 40 euros. I bet on a tennis match and won my bet, so I had about 80 euros in winnings. I decided to send my documents so they could send me the infamous code. Once I did that, they contacted me to say they were blocking my account due to an information error. I had put 1963 instead of 1962 for my date of birth. I tried everything (email, phone call, etc.), but they brushed me off and told me I was no longer welcome with them. As proof, it is impossible for me to create an account with them again because my personal information is in the database. All this to say that it's a lost cause; the money will never be found. However, when it comes to taking money, there are no issues. Even when I signed up for Betclic, I didn't even receive the 100 euros bonus offer!
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Bête question même si je me doute de la réponse, pourquoi ces 60 euros seraient donc pour Betclic au final ?
En effet, deux cas possibles.
1 - une personne frauduleuse utilise une carte par exemple volée.
Vous bloquez le compte mais encaissez quand même l'argent ??
2 - La personne est honnête mais comme dans ce cas plus haut se trompe, vous gardez l'argent aussi ??
Il y a un grand quelque chose qui me chagrine là-dedans....
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Merci de cliquer sur "Marquer comme résolu" si votre problème est réglé ! -
Hello,
Is there a law regarding the dates and place of birth or is it more of an internal regulation at Betclic?
Best regards
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Thank you for clicking "Mark as resolved" if your issue is resolved! -
Hello Night Templar,
In response to your remarks:
1/2/3/
All these points have been detailed in previous posts, I invite you to refer to them.
If one or more points are still unclear, I encourage you to contact the Ministry of Budget directly, as they are the ones behind these laws.
We will be happy to assist leo119 with the approval of the competent authorities.
To conclude this discussion, I will take the example of a driver being stopped for running a red light.
You will agree that it is not useful to take it out on the police officer who stops you, as he is just enforcing the law!!
The situation is the same for Betclic, a law has been passed, and we must respect it, that’s all.
Best regards
Stephane - Betclic-
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Hello everyone and thank you for your various posts.
As of today, no solution has been provided to me by Betclic, despite several emails, and the response is always the same, with the usual spiel you read above.
Let’s take a step back and imagine if the same rule existed in everyday life: you make one mistake when entering your card code, the bank then blocks your account and takes everything in it, with no recourse possible; you make one mistake in your civil status when buying a car, and you won't get the car or the money back. ... that’s scary. ..
In my case, they explain that it’s the law, so it’s "honest." I believe that honesty is governed by each person’s conscience, not by the law, and in my case to be called a "fraudster" (see the message during my identification: "account closed for fraud") is dishonest. Basically, they take your money due to a mistake, and you are the one labeled as the dishonest "fraudster."
What surprises me the most is that the CNIL, which defines rights regarding the use of personal data on the internet, says this:
"Everyone may have information concerning them rectified, completed, updated, locked, or erased when errors, inaccuracies, or the presence of data whose collection, use, communication, or retention is prohibited have been detected.
The right of rectification is an essential complement to the right of access."
This is, in fact, directly consultable on the CNIL's website: http://www.cnil.fr/vos-libertes/vos-droits/le-droit-de-rectification/ -
At worst, send them a registered letter, insisting that they correct this information, citing the law if necessary.
Attach a photocopy of your ID
They are obliged (no matter what the other guy above says) to change the place of birth; and once modified, they have no reason to block your account anymore. -
Hello,
In my opinion, the aforementioned decree leaves room for interpretation, and the interpretation made by Betclic is either incorrect or deliberately restrictive.
The decree states that the account owner must be reimbursed "unless the documents establish that he was not authorized to play at the time the provisional account was active."
However, being authorized to play does not necessarily mean that the account creation form had to be filled out correctly, but rather that the account holder must be identified and must not be subject to a gaming ban.
Indeed, if we refer to the intent of the drafters of this decree, we see that the objective is to protect compulsive players and those dependent on excess.
Thus, if the account holder demonstrates that he is not banned from playing (notably by proving his identity and cross-referencing with the list of banned players), he should logically and in accordance with the spirit of the decree be able to recover his funds.
Moreover, the identity of the account creator is easily identifiable in an objective manner or through a series of clues, without the existing errors on the form being an obstacle since:
1) You record the IP addresses and use cookies that allow the identification of the computers/networks used to create an account;
2) The bank account/credit card referenced allows for the identification of the person who owns the funds deposited into the Betclic account.
3) The identity documents and bank identifiers sent help confirm that the person requesting reimbursement is indeed the one who created the account.
In my opinion, you should therefore refund the account creator if he is not subject to a gaming ban and close the account to allow for the creation of a new account since the account creator is not authorized to modify the date and place of birth and this account can consequently never be validated definitively.
Imagine, for example, that the account is indeed a fake, poorly filled out by a third party, and that the true owner of the bank account has been deprived of 1000 euros; would you keep the 1000 euros for 5 years before cashing them in until the account creator has sent documents corresponding to the form, to the detriment of the rights of the true owner of the funds?
Your interpretation of the decree goes far beyond the intentions of its drafters and contradicts fundamental principles.
I remind you that the right to property has constitutional value (the Constitution, according to the hierarchy of norms as established by Kelsen, is indeed above the decree) since 1982 and is "among the natural and inalienable rights of Man, the preservation of which constitutes one of the goals of political society."
Blocking and cashing in a sum of money that does not belong to you while evidence has been provided that the account creator is not banned from playing and is indeed the owner of the identified bank account and transferred funds resembles bad faith expropriation.
Since you say this situation is causing you to lose clients and considering what has been stated previously, it appears that you should simply close the account, refund the owner, and allow him to create a new account.
In doing so, you would meet the legislative requirements, satisfy your client, and avoid losing many clients and potential clients.
Sincerely.
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Thank you for writing your message,
I almost deposited 500 euros with them.
I did not appreciate the way the Betclic representative responded.
Good luck. -
BETCLIC IS A ROOM OF THIEVES. I AM A POKER PLAYER AND FOR ABOUT FIVE MONTHS I HAVE BEEN RELOADING MY ACCOUNT EVERY DAY.
EVERY TIME I AM ABOUT TO WIN A LARGE AMOUNT, I AM TOLD I AM OFFLINE.
I CONFIRM BETCLIC IS STEALING, YES THEY ARE THIEVES, I RECONFIRM.
SO IF YOU HAVE A BETCLIC ACCOUNT, WITHDRAW YOUR BALANCE AND GO TO ANOTHER ROOM.
I KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT, THEY ARE THIEVES AND THEY DO NOT HIDE IT. WHEN YOU CONTACT THEM IN LIVE CHAT AND THEY KNOW YOU ARE RIGHT, THEY TRACK YOU.
BETCLIC THIEF -
Hello, please help me unlock my Betclic account, my account has been blocked during the verification of my documents.
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Hello, I would like to follow up with you regarding the various messages sent previously on this post.
As you know, Betclic, like all operators holding a license in France for online sports betting, must comply with the current legislation (decree no. 2010-518 of May 19, 2010).
When you register on Betclic (or another operator), we strongly encourage you to double-check that your personal information is correct at the time of confirming your registration.
Despite all the "alert" messages present on the site during registration, and as you can see in many forums, many people make mistakes regarding their First Name/Last Name/Birth Date and Place of Birth.
Regarding the account validation process with Betclic, once it is created, as soon as the first deposit is made, the account becomes a "temporary" account, at which point the holder has a 30-day period to submit their supporting documents (Identity document + Bank details) before the temporary account closure.
Before sending the supporting documents (I emphasize "before sending"), a player can request a modification of their first and last name, provided the error was made unintentionally (A player who already has a Betclic account and enters incorrect personal information to bypass the checks performed by our system, especially for those on the list of banned players, will not be able to modify them).
Regarding the date and place of birth, these two pieces of information are strictly non-modifiable, whether the request is made before or after the submission of the documents.
Please note that these measures are not specific to Betclic; you will find exactly the same with all operators complying with the current legislation.
In conclusion, know that it is not in our interest to close accounts for this type of error, as we are well aware that a customer whose account has just been closed due to an error in one of their personal details (Regardless of the account balance) is unlikely to return to Betclic... Unfortunately, the current legislation must be respected, and we do hope for a relaxation on this issue in the coming months.
@leo119: If you wish to open a new account at Betclic, please contact us beforehand, and we will be able to offer you our welcome offer again (First bet refunded up to 100 Euros).
For any additional requests, do not hesitate to contact us directly via our site from 8 am to midnight (By Chat/Phone/Email), we will be happy to respond to your inquiries.
Sportingly
Stephane, Betclic-
I was charged several times with amounts of 80 euros on my bank account even though I never played those amounts!! I had to block my card and close my Beltic account to stop this. I plan to take legal action because over 500 euros have been illegally withdrawn from me. It's a scandal to scam people like this.
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Hello graffx, I can understand your point of view.
Indeed, these procedures have been put in place to prevent any type of fraud and to protect French players.
Please note that these procedures apply to all operators licensed in France.
I invite you to read Article 8 of decree n°2010-518 of May 19, 2010:
Article 8:
The operator closing a provisional player account informs the player of the reason for this closure.
If the account has a credit balance, the operator must immediately set aside the corresponding amount, for a duration of five years from the closure of the account.
During this period, and without prejudice to the application of Article L. 561-16 of the monetary and financial code under the conditions set out in Article 9, the account holder can obtain the payment of the amount of the credit balance by providing the operator with the documents required in Article 4, unless these documents establish that the player was not authorized to play when the provisional account was active.
You will understand that we cannot unfortunately afford to violate these laws even if it would be in the interest of our clients (at the risk of losing our license in French territory).
Hoping for a forthcoming relaxation of the current legislation, all I can do is wish you good luck with your future bets.-
me, I also read in the same article: "the account holder can obtain the payment of the credit balance by providing the operator with the documents required in Article 4"
so, you are obliged to return his money...- Hello Night Templar,
I invite you to check article 4, which states that the account holder must send a form of identification strictly in accordance with the information registered on the player account.
Before sending the supporting documents (I emphasize "before sending"), a player can request the modification of their first and last name, provided that the error was made unintentionally (A player who already has a Betclic account and provides incorrect personal information to bypass the controls carried out by our system, especially those on the self-exclusion list, will not be able to modify them).
Regarding the date and place of birth, these two pieces of information are strictly unmodifiable, whether the request is made before or after sending the documents.
In the case of "Leo119", the error lies with the place of birth, unfortunately we cannot do anything in this situation.
Best regards
Stephane - Betclic
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I don't give a damn about reading your charter...
The law is clear: it is mandatory to allow the user to access and modify their data. So this impossibility is not legal in itself.
And I don't see how Article 2 contradicts the fact that you must refund this person...
I therefore encourage them to file a complaint; the ensuing trial is sure to be won by our friend Leo...
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Hello graffx,
Attached is the letter from the ARJEL (which is, for your information, the guarantor of compliance with current legislation) sent to players contacting them regarding this type of issue:
Your email informing us of the problem you are experiencing with your online gaming site has received our full attention.
The issue of the procedures for opening and closing a player account with an operator licensed by the ARJEL is indeed very important, and our services closely monitor the way operators assist players in their processes.
Current regulations impose particularly strict obligations on operators in this matter, with the aim of protecting the general public from potential fraud risks.
It is within this framework that the monitoring mission of operators licensed by the ARJEL is carried out: while the law does not provide for the Authority to act as a mediator between players and their operators – their relationships being governed by commercial and contractual relations – it remains that the operational services maintain heightened vigilance in this area.
We would also like to remind you that, regarding the procedures for opening and closing player accounts, it is Decree No. 2010-518 of May 19, 2010, relating to the availability of gaming and betting offers by operators licensed for online gaming or betting that applies.
According to Article 3 of the decree, prior to the operator verifying the required documents (identity documents and a document referencing the payment account), only a provisional player account can be opened, which does not allow its holder to request the transfer, even partial, of the credit balance of this account to their payment account.
The operator proposing the opening of a provisional account informs the player requesting the opening of such an account of its operating conditions. When the player requests the opening of a provisional account, the operator asks them to explicitly accept these operating conditions.
According to Article 12 of the decree, the player can modify the personal information concerning them, excluding that related to their date and place of birth.
Article 7 of the decree specifies that the operator must close a player account without delay when its holder: Provides documents containing information that do not match those they entered when opening the account;
In accordance with Article 8 of the decree, the operator closing a provisional player account must inform the player of the reason for this closure.
If the account has a credit balance, the operator must immediately set aside the corresponding sum for a period of five years from the closure of the account.
Despite the operational controls that the ARJEL can already carry out with licensed operators, our Authority cannot intervene in your dispute.
I hope this document will satisfy you and meet your expectations.
Please know once again that these are not rules defined by Betclic but by current legislation; any breach of these rules could cost Betclic a suspension/removal of our license that allows us to operate in French territory.
Best regards
Stephane - Betclic-
According to Article 12 of the decree, the player can modify the personal information concerning him, excluding that related to his date and place of birth.
1) he does not want to MODIFY but to CORRECT the information concerning him
2) if he cannot correct the fields himself; you can do it... and he is entitled to request it, since you have proof that the information to be corrected is incorrect
3) it is stated in your site's charter that the holder can request a refund; even if the information is incorrect, he remains the holder of the account... -
BETCLIC IS A ROOM OF THIEVES. I AM A POKER PLAYER AND FOR ABOUT FIVE MONTHS I HAVE BEEN RECHARGING MY ACCOUNT EVERY DAY.
EVERY TIME I AM SUPPOSED TO WIN A LARGE AMOUNT, I AM TOLD I AM OFFLINE.
I CONFIRM BETCLIC IS A THEFT YES, THEY ARE THIEVES, I RECONFIRM.
SO IF YOU HAVE A BETCLIC ACCOUNT, WITHDRAW YOUR BALANCE AND GO TO ANOTHER ROOM.
I KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT, THEY ARE THIEVES, AND THEY DON'T EVEN HIDE IT. WHEN YOU CONTACT THEM IN LIVE CHAT, WHEN THEY KNOW YOU ARE RIGHT, THEY TRACE YOU.
BETCLIC THIEF -
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