[Scam/Fraud] + harassment by NCO EUROPE
nokeleven
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coeurdor -
coeurdor -
Good evening,
I will try to explain as best as I can what happened to me, quite a mess. Let’s start from the beginning:
A few months ago, I sold a laptop through eBay for €1200 (approximately, I don't have the exact amount in mind).
The buyer contacted me by email and explained that for payment he prefers a cash handover to avoid shipping costs and the risk of the laptop being damaged by La Poste, and since he lives nearby, it works out perfectly. The guy seems cool, he just shelled out €1200 so I say okay and give him my phone number to contact me. Which he does. I feel good about it and we agree to meet in a busy place in town.
Before going to the meeting with the laptop, I checked that the money had indeed been received in my PayPal account. Perfect, the account shows it, I cash the money.
Later we meet at the pre-agreed location for the cash handover.
I go there as planned and meet a guy who is supposed to be my buyer, I ask him if he can show me an ID. He does. It matches. I hand him the laptop, we chat a bit (the guy is really nice) and off we go.
One month later I receive a message from PayPal saying that I owe them €1200, my account is in the negative and they are demanding the money.
I contact PayPal and they explain that X has disputed the charge because his card was used fraudulently to pay me. The PayPal guy explains that there was an internal investigation and they concluded that the person who came to pick up the laptop paid with X's card which doesn't belong to him (they're good at PayPal, huh!!!!!!).
Anyway, X goes after his bank for a refund, his bank refunds X who was the victim of the fraud, and the bank asks PayPal to refund the amount they refunded to X. Which PayPal does. PayPal decides that since it is impossible to identify the scammer to whom I sold the laptop, that I owe them the €1200 they refunded to the bank.
I haven’t paid (normal right? I’m indirectly the financial victim of fraud and on top of that, I have to pay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The pot calling the kettle black!!!). Not having paid, PayPal contacts NCO EUROPE. NCO Europe is a collection agency. This same agency works like this I believe: it buys the debts from its clients (in this case PayPal) and then its goal is to recover the money from the debtor (in this case Me). Unlike PayPal, they have the means to make me OBLIGED to pay.
So now, I’m being HARASSED (phone calls, letters) for payment. It really grates on me to hear this nonsense and I would like to know what options I have?
Do I have a chance of winning a lawsuit when they take me to court for payment? Knowing that these guys likely have skilled lawyers.
If I lose, can I be considered insolvent (not being a major, 16 years old, and having no income... )
In fact, what should I do to get out of this mess?
Wouldn’t it be absurd that I am “punished” by the justice system just because I didn’t pay?!
Last questions:
If the money (€1200) was dirty money, why are eBay and PayPal not being prosecuted for receiving stolen property? Because those c***s didn’t forget to take their commission on the transaction!!! (for every sale made they take their percentage)
PayPal is supposed to wait 120 days (4 months) after notifying me that my account is in the negative before referring it to a collection agency (I’m not 100% sure but I believe so). However, a month and a half after being notified by PayPal, I started being harassed by NCO EUROPE. Isn’t there some kind of procedural flaw there?
I thank in advance anyone who can advise or help me... :'(
Goodbye.
I will try to explain as best as I can what happened to me, quite a mess. Let’s start from the beginning:
A few months ago, I sold a laptop through eBay for €1200 (approximately, I don't have the exact amount in mind).
The buyer contacted me by email and explained that for payment he prefers a cash handover to avoid shipping costs and the risk of the laptop being damaged by La Poste, and since he lives nearby, it works out perfectly. The guy seems cool, he just shelled out €1200 so I say okay and give him my phone number to contact me. Which he does. I feel good about it and we agree to meet in a busy place in town.
Before going to the meeting with the laptop, I checked that the money had indeed been received in my PayPal account. Perfect, the account shows it, I cash the money.
Later we meet at the pre-agreed location for the cash handover.
I go there as planned and meet a guy who is supposed to be my buyer, I ask him if he can show me an ID. He does. It matches. I hand him the laptop, we chat a bit (the guy is really nice) and off we go.
One month later I receive a message from PayPal saying that I owe them €1200, my account is in the negative and they are demanding the money.
I contact PayPal and they explain that X has disputed the charge because his card was used fraudulently to pay me. The PayPal guy explains that there was an internal investigation and they concluded that the person who came to pick up the laptop paid with X's card which doesn't belong to him (they're good at PayPal, huh!!!!!!).
Anyway, X goes after his bank for a refund, his bank refunds X who was the victim of the fraud, and the bank asks PayPal to refund the amount they refunded to X. Which PayPal does. PayPal decides that since it is impossible to identify the scammer to whom I sold the laptop, that I owe them the €1200 they refunded to the bank.
I haven’t paid (normal right? I’m indirectly the financial victim of fraud and on top of that, I have to pay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The pot calling the kettle black!!!). Not having paid, PayPal contacts NCO EUROPE. NCO Europe is a collection agency. This same agency works like this I believe: it buys the debts from its clients (in this case PayPal) and then its goal is to recover the money from the debtor (in this case Me). Unlike PayPal, they have the means to make me OBLIGED to pay.
So now, I’m being HARASSED (phone calls, letters) for payment. It really grates on me to hear this nonsense and I would like to know what options I have?
Do I have a chance of winning a lawsuit when they take me to court for payment? Knowing that these guys likely have skilled lawyers.
If I lose, can I be considered insolvent (not being a major, 16 years old, and having no income... )
In fact, what should I do to get out of this mess?
Wouldn’t it be absurd that I am “punished” by the justice system just because I didn’t pay?!
Last questions:
If the money (€1200) was dirty money, why are eBay and PayPal not being prosecuted for receiving stolen property? Because those c***s didn’t forget to take their commission on the transaction!!! (for every sale made they take their percentage)
PayPal is supposed to wait 120 days (4 months) after notifying me that my account is in the negative before referring it to a collection agency (I’m not 100% sure but I believe so). However, a month and a half after being notified by PayPal, I started being harassed by NCO EUROPE. Isn’t there some kind of procedural flaw there?
I thank in advance anyone who can advise or help me... :'(
Goodbye.
9 réponses
No, I don’t have the same problem; I’m being harassed by an insurance company that I have already paid.
First, if the letters are sent normally and you are contacted by phone,
do not sign anything for them; go to the gendarmerie to explain the scam.
File a complaint and then send a letter to the public prosecutor from your area.
Tell your parents, close your real bank account while explaining the situation to your bank manager.
After that, close your PayPal account.
Wait for them to take action; as soon as they do, proceed with the process.
Consult with the prosecutor's office at your local court for advice.
Prove your good faith and know that justice is also there to help you.
Good luck and courage!
do not sign anything for them; go to the gendarmerie to explain the scam.
File a complaint and then send a letter to the public prosecutor from your area.
Tell your parents, close your real bank account while explaining the situation to your bank manager.
After that, close your PayPal account.
Wait for them to take action; as soon as they do, proceed with the process.
Consult with the prosecutor's office at your local court for advice.
Prove your good faith and know that justice is also there to help you.
Good luck and courage!
I had exactly the same story
I directly filed a lawsuit against the client
but still not resolved
here are two links:
http://www.paypalsucks.com/cgi-sys/suspendedpage.cgi?fid=3&tid=10103&old_block=0
http://www.e-monsite.com/ensemblecontrepaypal/
I directly filed a lawsuit against the client
but still not resolved
here are two links:
http://www.paypalsucks.com/cgi-sys/suspendedpage.cgi?fid=3&tid=10103&old_block=0
http://www.e-monsite.com/ensemblecontrepaypal/
Yes, I'm fed up too. They tell me your PayPal account has been limited; I didn't create a PayPal account, etc...
Honestly, PayPal is a SHAME!
One day, after leaving my freshly received bank card with someone for a few minutes, this person took advantage of it to create a PayPal account in their name with MY card in no time...
In the meantime, I discovered nearly €400 worth of fraudulent transactions via PayPal...
Knowing the culprit, I decided to handle the issue amicably... This person then gave me access to the fraudulent account! I managed, with some difficulty, to change the password and link it to my email address... But it is impossible to change the credit card number, change the address, or the name of the account owner!!! (Indeed, PayPal assumes that a card owner doesn't change their name! hehe) And it's impossible to delete it to create a new account in my name, as my credit card number is already in use!
So I'm left forced to use this "chimera" account for my future purchases via PayPal...
But two months later, when I wanted to make my first legitimate purchase via PayPal, surprise! I was able to complete the transaction! But since it was from a geographically distant location (combined with the password changes and everything...), PayPal agents suspected that the last transaction was fraudulent (and not the earlier ones that were indeed fraudulent!), and therefore locked my account! (not to mention canceling my last purchase, which was only €17 by the way... Nothing to do with the €400 stolen!)
I now find myself in the madness of PayPal paperwork to remedy my account, dealing more with ROBOTS than with human beings! (Indeed, it is impossible to contact them by email, and it’s a robot you get on the phone!).
Yet, given the complexity of the issue, I would need fewer constraints in communication regarding the process to rectify things! I am dealing with blatant conflicts of names and addresses in the requested supporting documents, and it's impossible to get out of it!
And it took THREE MONTHS for PayPal to finally ask for supporting documents to verify the authenticity of the cardholder!
While the fraudster only needed 5 MINUTES to create the fraudulent PayPal account, without the SLIGHTEST JUSTIFICATION, and it was immediately usable!
PayPal's security rules amaze me! They should ask for these supporting documents at the time of registration, not 3 months after the account is created! (During which time the fraudster could enjoy this account with complete peace of mind!) So, it's me who is considered the fraudulent user, and I am asked for paperwork that is impossible to provide as a student!
Well... I hope this serves as a lesson for everyone who has had issues with PayPal. :(
One day, after leaving my freshly received bank card with someone for a few minutes, this person took advantage of it to create a PayPal account in their name with MY card in no time...
In the meantime, I discovered nearly €400 worth of fraudulent transactions via PayPal...
Knowing the culprit, I decided to handle the issue amicably... This person then gave me access to the fraudulent account! I managed, with some difficulty, to change the password and link it to my email address... But it is impossible to change the credit card number, change the address, or the name of the account owner!!! (Indeed, PayPal assumes that a card owner doesn't change their name! hehe) And it's impossible to delete it to create a new account in my name, as my credit card number is already in use!
So I'm left forced to use this "chimera" account for my future purchases via PayPal...
But two months later, when I wanted to make my first legitimate purchase via PayPal, surprise! I was able to complete the transaction! But since it was from a geographically distant location (combined with the password changes and everything...), PayPal agents suspected that the last transaction was fraudulent (and not the earlier ones that were indeed fraudulent!), and therefore locked my account! (not to mention canceling my last purchase, which was only €17 by the way... Nothing to do with the €400 stolen!)
I now find myself in the madness of PayPal paperwork to remedy my account, dealing more with ROBOTS than with human beings! (Indeed, it is impossible to contact them by email, and it’s a robot you get on the phone!).
Yet, given the complexity of the issue, I would need fewer constraints in communication regarding the process to rectify things! I am dealing with blatant conflicts of names and addresses in the requested supporting documents, and it's impossible to get out of it!
And it took THREE MONTHS for PayPal to finally ask for supporting documents to verify the authenticity of the cardholder!
While the fraudster only needed 5 MINUTES to create the fraudulent PayPal account, without the SLIGHTEST JUSTIFICATION, and it was immediately usable!
PayPal's security rules amaze me! They should ask for these supporting documents at the time of registration, not 3 months after the account is created! (During which time the fraudster could enjoy this account with complete peace of mind!) So, it's me who is considered the fraudulent user, and I am asked for paperwork that is impossible to provide as a student!
Well... I hope this serves as a lesson for everyone who has had issues with PayPal. :(
I have a problem, I made several sales on eBay and now eBay is asking me to pay €36 in listing fees. I received a call from NCO Europe twice. Is it normal that they are asking me to pay?
Hi
Well, I read your story, and I'm in the same mess.
About 4 years ago, I sold phones on eBay for someone in Romania because I'm an intermediary reseller on the internet.
I went through the same problem of supposedly sending to the customer; the customers never received the phones I sold on PayPal, and I paid the guy in advance.
Anyway, PayPal refunded the customers without asking me anything and is now asking me for about 800 euros in fees, etc., and that there's one phone I supposedly didn't refund to a customer.
I just learned all this from a company called NCO Europe, a number in England (00441772843216) that bothers me twice a week.
I told them straight up to screw off; I got scammed out of 1800 euros in total, and now I have to pay 800 euros to PayPal.
No problem, I'm changing my phone number tomorrow.
They can look for me themselves, that stupid PayPal company.
Why don't they contact their customers and just pass everything on to another company that harasses us 2 to 3 times a week????? I don't know how they got my number either.
Plus, I didn't answer, they left on my voicemail that it was urgentttttttttttttt.
I called back, so that cost me to call them; I said I would contact PayPal myself, and they gave me a case number, which of course I will never do since I'm changing my mobile number tomorrow. Furthermore, the address they have is not even the right one, so don't worry, let it go, and in 10 years it will be expired, or maybe even 3 or 5 years—I don't know; if anyone could inform me, that would help!!! How many years before the case gets forgotten? Thanks, and let's keep in touch.
Well, I read your story, and I'm in the same mess.
About 4 years ago, I sold phones on eBay for someone in Romania because I'm an intermediary reseller on the internet.
I went through the same problem of supposedly sending to the customer; the customers never received the phones I sold on PayPal, and I paid the guy in advance.
Anyway, PayPal refunded the customers without asking me anything and is now asking me for about 800 euros in fees, etc., and that there's one phone I supposedly didn't refund to a customer.
I just learned all this from a company called NCO Europe, a number in England (00441772843216) that bothers me twice a week.
I told them straight up to screw off; I got scammed out of 1800 euros in total, and now I have to pay 800 euros to PayPal.
No problem, I'm changing my phone number tomorrow.
They can look for me themselves, that stupid PayPal company.
Why don't they contact their customers and just pass everything on to another company that harasses us 2 to 3 times a week????? I don't know how they got my number either.
Plus, I didn't answer, they left on my voicemail that it was urgentttttttttttttt.
I called back, so that cost me to call them; I said I would contact PayPal myself, and they gave me a case number, which of course I will never do since I'm changing my mobile number tomorrow. Furthermore, the address they have is not even the right one, so don't worry, let it go, and in 10 years it will be expired, or maybe even 3 or 5 years—I don't know; if anyone could inform me, that would help!!! How many years before the case gets forgotten? Thanks, and let's keep in touch.